Well, maybe an example of Latvian and Lithuanian, and other European, renaissance will help. Lithuanian renaissance in 19th century was connected to Catholic church, but Latvian renaissance was not so much connected to church (Latvians were/are Lutherans). Furthermore, Poles, who were Catholics, had their identity tied to Catholic church, just like in case of Lithuanians. But Estonians and Finns, who were Lutherans, didn't have their identities much connected to church, similarly to case of Latvians. Why such difference? As you see, there is some differences along the lines of Lutheran and Catholic churches. But I think it°s not the only explanation. There's also some history behind. But it's long story. In brief, Catholic church was main place, where books in Polish or Lithuanian languages were printed and published, the religiousity of Catholic people also was more deep, so they connected themselves to church more than the "more shallow" Lutherans. Catholic church helped to preserve and develop national languages. In case of Lutheran church situation was different. Lutheran church helped to develop network of schools, who were less religious than Catholic schools were. And books were often printed not in churches, but in common publishers. Well, system was different. In overall Lutheran church wasn't so involved into national awakening like Catholic church was.
So what could we say about Orthodox church? Has it been ever involved into renaissance of Russian Finno-Ugric ethnicities, ever helped to preserve or develop their languages etc.? Is Orthodox church closely connected to identities of ethnicities? If no, then I can say that role of Orthodox church could be more like role of Lutheran, than that of Catholic church.
We should ask God to bless our ways and movement.
Hi, all. I find this religious question to be very good take on FU-Renaissance, FU-identity and FU-ethnicity and I like to read your views on eg catholic Lithuania.
Well. In modern Finland the main creeds are Lutheran and 1% Orthodox, under Ecumenical Patriarchete of Constantinople, autonomous local church. Departed from Moscva along Finland's national independence (1917) and new religious laws ruled in early 1920's.
To shed light on Finnish history in this fu-respect: In Finland Luther (via Mikael Agricola from Turku) gave us Finnish language in writing in 16th century, along with the Bible translation. Lutherans are more pietic and transcendent on folk traditions, whereas Orthodox church here has assimilated Carelian folk beliefs in a way that has been seen in Purist Lutheran history, in it's most strict ideas, even as PAGANISM (!), in some occasions.
Finnish orths are internationally famous of Ecumenism, peaceful inter-creed relations and eg. developing Sami church language. Of course this stems partly from the fact that Orthodox church is a minority in Finland, thus not deeply entangled in state politics.
So, in short: As long as Russian Orthodox Church is regarded as Panslavic and not in peace and begged and forgived her grim past of hundreds of years, the tension stays. I hope Renaissance finds safe and solid ground. Maybe only step by step, because nowadays main discussed item is the reconciliation process of last century's State-Communist Ideology which caused terrible, violent damage and devastation to both churches AND ethnicities.
Sometimes I ironically, as a lingvistically trained person, see ancient saints Kyrillos and Methodios (cyrillics) the MAIN obstacles of information flow and break-away from the status quo. If we had same vocabulary... :)
Our Renaissance was National-Romantic Movement of 19th century and our Art history Golden Era grew from eg. publication of national epic "full" Kalevala 1850's and resulted in jugend-style national art in 1900's first decade.
Now it's all past and gone and we are modernisized, we have had our fair share of Western traditions. Atlanto-uralic.:)
God's blessing to the movement, Artur, of course.. Terribly worst scenario would be the fate of Tsetsenia, Religion-motivated Guerilla War... Terrible even as a thought!!!
Re Orthodox: Folk language promoting canonical churches are in Finland, in Estonia, where else? Parishes, metropolitans?
If you say Ethnicity = Paganism, you create Marginalization. - this is a big question. Works the same way as Communist idea of the "Church of Babushkii".
We should trust in other confession by reason of the high level of assimilation. This process is closely connected with orthodox church. If we consider the Caucasian and Turkic nations, they have the protection from the assimilation through Islam religion. As for me, it's more important to trust honestly, by soul, and the confession is less important. I am baptised,Orthodox. I was baptised, when I was 4 or 5 years old.
It is a term called ''National Church" - that mean christian church of a nation. Many have them, but for ex., neither Estonia, neither Finland, neither Latvia, neither Lithuania does not have them. There is Church of England and ec. Lithuanian Catholics belongs to Roman Catholic church - so no National Church, similar in Latvia too. Not sure about Hungary. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_church
In Russia as I see there is only Russian Orthodox church - so, there is no local Udmurtian or other churches.
Yes, I agree, that if people should be able to have mass in their language - would be great. But as I see - Russian Orthodox church is in power today and related with government, because church and government is not separated as it could be elsewere. Russian church and Russian government helps each other. So, - no mass in local languages there!
In Finland also the TrueFinn nationalistics talk bad and foul words of so-called multiculturalism. But diversity it is the only way to live together. High-church-islam is of course protective but it should loosen up likewise. The cultural connections on higher and especially on LOWER, EVERYDAY levels are the solution to let creeds live together. Of course this is a impossible problem to solve on paper, concrete and considerate actions taken are the most important level. We in Finland for example write Carelian in latin alphabet, russians do it in kyrillic, as far as i know. Kyrillic came to use there in the late 1930's. http://reocities.com/athens/4280/lisuri8.html#8.2 link just to give you an idea and glimpse to it.
If we can resist the temptation and refuse to Demonize other, different believers, we would have taken a big step ahead. Getting Orthodox and Islamic worlds to everyday peace would give a strong hand to FU-Renaissance too.
Mmm, and, yes. I was babtized Lutheran as a small baby, in cradle, later I chose myself to get charismated to join The Holy Orthodox Church around 24 yrs old.
Does the Lutheran church can help the Finno-Ugric nations to save the national identity?
Otherwise, prechristian believs also can help to imunise identification of belonging to ethnical group. So if speaking only about how to secure that - not only christian faith can help. Because some will say - christianisation is same as rusification, so restoration of prechristian believs someone can say is as a solutution. Anyway even some elements of that can help and that will not go against christian believs.
Uh. You have interersting ideas. I do not know. We must discuss this, perhaps here.