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Постоянная ссылка Ответил(а) Luhta Август 27, 2010 в 12:26pm

Финляндия считается самой лучшей страной в мире.

Постоянная ссылка Ответил(а) Numulunj pilgä Сентябрь 4, 2010 в 10:12pm

Helena said:

And Finland is otherwise a good country to live and Finland is always my home country.
But the bad things in Finland are high taxes and low interest in other Finno-Ugric peoples :(. Other European nations are more popular..

It's normal. What could excite interest of the Finnish to all those God-forgotten nations in Russia. Most Finnish never heard of them. What could offer them Finnic relatives in Volga and Urals? Investments, jobs, travelling, music, art? Just nothing comparing to Estonia for instance.

Постоянная ссылка Ответил(а) Luhta Сентябрь 5, 2010 в 9:22am

Numulunj pilgae:

What could offer them Finnic relatives in Volga and Urals? Investments, jobs, travelling, music, art? Just nothing comparing to Estonia for instance.

I know what they could give - Finnish understanding their place in the world, their self-understanding. Right now Finns think they are like Western Europeans with some "oddities". These "oddities" are Finnish language, sauna culture, buildings called luhti or aitta and few others. Finns think little that these "oddities" are somehow linked to other ethnicities, who live eastwards. Finns now think that they are just "odd" and somehow "different" than other people. Well, if Finns would know their eastern relatives, they wouldn't feel so odd or different anymore, because they would see, that there are also many other ethnicities, who speak "odd" languages (besides Estonians), who have sauna culture (many ethnicities in European part of Russia, also Baltic ethnicities), who have something very similar to aitta or luhti buildings (most of Finno-Ugric ethnicities). Finns wouldn't feel so alone with "oddities" anymore IMO. And it is big contribution to self-esteem.

Постоянная ссылка Ответил(а) Luhta Сентябрь 5, 2010 в 9:37am

Helena said:

Russia isn't well known in Finland. Russia should be more advertised. The Finns think usually that "Russians" only live in Russia. Other ethnic groups are unknown. I think that Finns should turn on their own ancestry.

Yes, that's unfortunately is true. But there can be something done. There have to be new books released in Finnish language about the Finno-Ugric people, there should be new Udmurt or Komi restaurants opened in Helsinki, there should be some TV programm shown about the Finno-Ugric ethnicities in Russia...


But the Finns think that they are inferior than the Swedes, and it doesn't help.

But what could help - the Finns should think that they are lucky in comparision to unlucky eastern Finno-Ugrics. Finns should understand more the cost of their freedom.


But today, many Finns prefer Russian (or other language) than Swedish. We have a mandatory Swedish and it takes time.

Yes, this Swedish language law should be changed. Of course, the Swedish-speakers should have still the protection of their mother tongue, but it shouldn't be the law anymore, that Finnish speakers must learn Swedish language. Because Swedish language is rarely used in Finland, besides in Swedish-speaking circles, plus English language is much more used. And the Swedish-speaking people in Finland almost always know Finnish language, and Swedish people in Sweden almost always know English language. So really, what's the point of learning the Swedish language, expect if you really want to closely cooperate with Swedes, make big business with them, or live among them?

Personally, I don't speak Russian because I have not had time to study. But I understand the Cyrillic alphabet.

I guess it is difficult for a Finnish to learn the Russian language, already pronouncation is very difficult. But nothing is impossible, f.e. famous actor Ville Haapasalo now speaks Russian language nearly perfectly. Also Estonians in Soviet times were foreced to learn Russian language, and many of them speak more or less good in Russian language.

Постоянная ссылка Ответил(а) Numulunj pilgä Сентябрь 5, 2010 в 3:44pm

There have to be new books released in Finnish language about the Finno-Ugric people, there should be new Udmurt or Komi restaurants opened in Helsinki, there should be some TV programm shown about the Finno-Ugric ethnicities in Russia...

There are many problems. Russian alphabet used for Finnic languages (shifting to Latin script is banned), no tourism, no news, no contacts, no feedback. I can still remember they even discussed in late 1990s on Finland government level some opportunities/limits for Volga Urals Finnic emigration to Finland. But still only Filipino and Africans can easily come to Finland outside of EU so far. Mokshas, Udmurts, Maris are too poor as all RF "regions population" to invest into restaurants or shops in Finland. Now there is new "iron curtain" which is EU regulations and limits.

Last my visit to Helsinki I came to the bookstore in Stokmann building asking for Eeva Heralla and Aleksandr Feoktistov, Mokshalais - Suomalainen Sanakirja. Turku, 1998. Using my poor Finnish I had to explain first what means word mokshalais: - Minä olen mokshalainen. It didn't help. I used word mordvalainen, explaining that I was born Mordva tasavaltassa. No way, they never heard. Manager was so kind that he even called to Turku and assured me I can buy requested dictionary but unfo only in Turku. It was helpful, great, but even Helsinki bookstore staff never heard of Volga Finns.
Few Finns and Hungarians are aware of the fact Mordvins is derogatory for Mokshas and Erzyas. Mordvin language never existed, Mordvins as ethnic unity never existed. I'm still beating around the bush with wiki article Mordvins separation in order to avoid misunderstanding and dead-end articles. I managed to prove this in many wikis (German, Italian, Latin, Norwegian, Estonian, Ukrainian, etc even in Russian) but I failed with Finnish, Hungarian and of course English.

Постоянная ссылка Ответил(а) Niimshur Сентябрь 5, 2010 в 4:44pm

хе... мы хотим ли знаться с родственниками, ежели они бомжи? А для финнов мы - бомжи. Психологический барьер у них: "Тут еще и денег клянчить станут, ежели якшаться с ними"...
Трезвы толькор эстонцы, ибо - знают. Но - 1,5 поколения и - и они забудут. Это не их вина, а наша: это мы из лесов вовремя не вышли.

Постоянная ссылка Ответил(а) Luhta Сентябрь 5, 2010 в 8:11pm

There are many problems. Russian alphabet used for Finnic languages (shifting to Latin script is banned), no tourism, no news, no contacts, no feedback.

For every problem there is a solution. The alphabet problem can be solved, if in dictionaries paralelly is used latin writing system (like in Russian dictionaries for foreigners). Tourism issue also can be solved, if to make enough advertisment (print booklets, put advertisment in radio or newspapers etc., these should not be most expensive way of advertising). Problem with contacts - there is a solution called internet, and various forums. The Russia's Finno-Ugric people, who know English or Finnish language, should go to forums, where are many Finns. I already can give few forum adresses. About feedback - you have to convince people, that it is worth to support Finno-Ugrics. Because it is worth.

Mokshas, Udmurts, Maris are too poor as all RF "regions population" to invest into restaurants or shops in Finland.

I regard situation in Finland as somewhat abnormal. There are all kinds of Asian restaurants - Taiwanese, Chinese, Japanese, Nepalese etc. There are also Turkish kebabs, Italians pizzas and pasta, McDonald's etc. There is also at least some Finnish, Russian and Saami (Lapland) restaurants, prehaps also Estonian. But there is no one restaurant, which could be called as Udmurt, Komi, Mari, Erzya or Khanty. It's very pity situation.

Also about shops - there are different cloth shops, design shops, food shops etc. But there is no one, which could be connected to eastern Finno-Ugric styles, design etc. It's very, very pity. I am sure the eastern Finno-Ugrics can give loads of new, interesting input in clothes or jewellery. I myself regard f.e. traditional Khanty bags as very, very perspective, they look original yet stylish, they can really compete with design of many other bags. Also, Khanty make great jewellery from beads, it is really something. I haven't seen so good bead jewellery anywhere in Finland.

It is visible how people in Western countries have run out of ideas. They have tried as if almost everything - modernism, classicism, rock style, Indian or African style etc. And they return and return to the same, old stuff. How many times is going "retro", "American classic style" etc., this goes in circles and circles. Because no more ideas. But the eastern Finno-Ugrics can give totally fresh, new things, and it is a thing why is worth to open shops, where is sold stuff, made by eastern Finno-Ugric styles, design etc. Of course, some things can be similar to old ethnic Finnish things, but I don't think it is so bad.

Постоянная ссылка Ответил(а) Numulunj pilgä Сентябрь 5, 2010 в 10:43pm

Yes! Agree with you, Luhta! It's not the same as Russian underground "Red Wave" music for USA and Europe in 1990s it's something a good style can be build on
Foe instance http://www.torama.ru/dyrin/
Volga Finnish and Uralic handicrafts, paganism, culture, history, folklore etc are still unknown to Volga Finnish and Uralic people themselves. This is what we are ready to share, this is what may give new start in art, music, movie. This is what may give us opportunity to simply start a good business (design line, new genres, new scenarios, etc)

Постоянная ссылка Ответил(а) Numulunj pilgä Сентябрь 6, 2010 в 12:40am

Helena said:

I hope that Finland/Finns would help their language relatives..
We speak Finnish and it's very important to us. But why don't we think of the other Finno-Ugric speakers? What is the problem in Finland? I can't understand.
I'm looking forward to the day when they are popular in Finland! :)

Helena,
I believe this day will come when we all start talking to each other. The much we share our thoughts and opinions the sooner this day will come! Let us do not stop sharing ideas and opinions, this will help us to find the way out.